Discussion

[applea.livejournal.com]

While watching Blackadder over the weekend, I began to wonder- what would have happened if Rowan Atkinson had been asked to play Jeeves instead of Stephen Fry. I mean, Laurie's character is much the same (yet, dare I say it- smarter? in Plum's version) and both Blackadder and Jeeves share the similarities of serving the Prince/Wooster (henceforth shortened to Prince Wooster), rescuing him from the soup, being the cleverest one in the room, coming out ahead in every situation, and being darker to Prince Wooster's light.
Now, the characters are similar, but obviously different, so if Atkinson had gotten the role he'd be playing it slightly differently than he would his Blackadder role.

But it still stands Jeeves would probably sound much more blackadderish/malicious if he had gotten the role. How much do you think that would impact the message and interpretation of Plum's stories? And as a theoretical, which would you prefer/ think is more true to the stories?


For reference, here's a bit of Blackadder:
http://youtu.be/3iHPOabGtXs

Comments

[hazeltea.livejournal.com]

Rowan is a great comedic actor, but I don't think he's smooth and suave enough to pull off Plum's vision of Jeeves in his voice and mannerisms.

[applea.livejournal.com]

I concur, for the Jeeves we know. But if he changed that, if Jeeves was less suave and more snark- how would that change every aspect of the show? Bertie would have to be a lot thicker, much like the Prince. I think dogwoodblossum is quite right to say that it would end up being much like Blackadder, but could the cannon ever quite reassert itself? Would it be different than Blackadder, or would it be more of the same but in 1920?

Weighty thoughts for a Wodehousian.

[wotwotleigh.livejournal.com]

That's an interesting question. I agree with Hazeltea that Rowan doesn't quite exude the suavity and grace that I would look for in a good Jeeves (although that's not to say he wouldn't be capable of it). His Blackadder is not only more malicious than Jeeves, but generally cruder -- he's more tactless and easily riled.

I do think that Stephen Fry's Jeeves is considerably more gentle and indulgent than book!canon Jeeves. Plum's Jeeves always struck me as much more devilish and dry. Martin Jarvis in this version of By Jeeves (http://www.youtube.com/playlist?p=PL6FEA0D00900A2BCD) is actually a bit closer to what I always imagined when reading the books.

[applea.livejournal.com]

Oh that was delightful! :D Thanks for showing it old bean! But I'm interested to know with a Jeeves like that in mind, how slashable are the pair really? The age difference seems a pretty big bridge, as well as Jeeves' natural machinational habit (but we joyfully deal with that in every incarnation actually.)

[wotwotleigh.livejournal.com]

Glad you enjoyed it! :) As depicted in the play, they would definitely be a tad less slashable than the Fry and Laurie versions. But I think a somewhat younger Jeeves with a similar personality to the Jarvis!Jeeves could work. In my headcanon these days Jeeves is about 10 years older than Bertie.

[erynn999.livejournal.com]

I've been in relationships with people 10 years older than me before, and in the gay community it's not actually all that uncommon for older men to be interested in younger ones. I could see it, though I wouldn't like the vibe if Jeeves were too much older than Bertie. Of course, the older you get, the less those few extra years would matter -- 17 and 27 seems a huge gap, where 37 and 47 isn't all that much, really. I do tend to go for them being no more than about 7-8 years apart, though, and preferably really only about 5.

[wotwotleigh.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I would not want them to be much more than 10 years apart (for slashing purposes), but I don't think that's an insurmountable gap at all.

[derien.livejournal.com]

in the gay community it's not actually all that uncommon for older men to be interested in younger ones.

My stepsister's ex husband is involved with a guy barely older than his own (adopted) son, which is a little creepy. It the straight community it's not all that unusual for older guys to be interested in younger women. I'm not saying it's always bad, but... well. 10 years, though, is not all that bad. As I was assured by a guy 10 years younger than me who was at least sort of hitting on me at the time, and who is now, to the best of my knowledge, involved with a woman almost exactly my age.

[erynn999.livejournal.com]

Oh, I agree there's a thin line sometimes between okay and creepy. The key is finding ways to keep it from being creepy if you're writing an older Jeeves and you want it to work. In that sort of a case, I think I'd find it easier to swallow (so to speak) if Bertie were the one to approach Jeeves, given the usual dynamic of their relationship.

[margi-lynn.livejournal.com]

I think he could pull it off, but that Fry got the part because the producers actually wanted to tone down the books instead of making Jeeves meaner.

There are a couple of spots in the script that, I feel, if done by someone without as kind a presence as Fry can be, would be more devilish than they really wanted for tv.

In the show, there isn't a way to have Bertie's cheery and effervescent stream of consciousness color the perceptions of the audience. It's a third person perspective focused on Bertie.

By default, if the show was to keep the same spirit of happiness, the meanness towards Bertie would have to be toned down. And that's something I don't think Atkinson could do as well as Fry.

[hazeltea.livejournal.com]

I think the fact that Fry and Laurie were a successful double act had more to do with it than anything.

[applea.livejournal.com]

I like this theory! Never thought of it, but you're right. Without Bertie telling us he took no offense, we'd be taking offense at the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune for him!

Although I think the double act they had certainly helped. :o)

[saylee.livejournal.com]

Heh. I get angry on Bertie's behalf anyway. The two Brinkley Court episodes in season one made me want to smash something.

[margi-lynn.livejournal.com]

Same here. I still don't like the 'kinder and gentler' actions towards Bertie.

[dogwoodblossom.livejournal.com]

Heh, my first thought was that Rowan Atkinson also played Mr. Bean, so I'm picturing a Jeeves even stupider than Bertie.

Of course if you want to look at Atkinson playing a Jeeves-esq role, he voiced Zazu (the King's anal-retentive advisor bird) in The Lion King. So, even at his most uh...servile (though that word has some connotations that don't quite fit what I'm getting at...) he's still bossy and snide.

Rowan Atkinson likes to play the bad guy, so a Jeeves and Wooster with him as Jeeves would have to be a lot meaner. And for it to be funny instead of just mean, Bertie would have to be a lot stupider. And then we'd just have the last two books of Blackadder over again (which, granted, are hilarious).

Actually I read that Hugh Laurie's performance as George was what inspired them to ask him to play Bertie in the first place.

[applea.livejournal.com]

No, really? :0 Good lord, I wondered why his name was familiar!

And I suspected as such, which I why I pondered the question. :o) They're both loveable idiots...Bertie more lovable than most, of course.

[jameta4all.livejournal.com]

I've never felt Jeeves to be any sort of malicious to Wooster, even though a lot of his schemes do end up with Bertie looking a bit of a tit. I think that's just Jeeves having a bit of fun.
But Blackadder outright hates his employers/friends and his only reason for using schemes to make them look stupid is because if he was obvious he'd get his head lopped off.
Atkinson can definitely pull off suave ("I'd forgotten how dishy you are!") but I wouldn't be satisfied if he played Jeeves anywhere near the way he plays Blackadder. Blackadder always has a hint of smarm, which just isn't Jeeves.

[applea.livejournal.com]

Yes, that's it exactly! What I'm curious is what the fanbase thinks- could Atkinson change his mannerisms sufficiently enough to suit the role? Or would Blackadder bleed in?

[thistlethorn.livejournal.com]

What I'm curious is what the fanbase thinks- could Atkinson change his mannerisms sufficiently enough to suit the role?

I certainly think so. Atkinson has played very kindhearted characters (Four Weddings And A Funeral; Keeping Mum), so I definitely think he has the range to have played Jeeves as the rather gentler, kinder version the Fry and Laurie production gave us (which I definitely prefer, relationship-wise, to the books, and which tempers for me some of the less considerate bits of humor in the books. Not to say that I don't adore the books; I do). But I think it's just as well we weren't given an Atkinson-Laurie pair; it would have put viewers (or this viewer, at least) in mind of Blackadder and Prince George.

"Prince Wooster" just slayed me. LOL

[erynn999.livejournal.com]

I think too much Blackadder would have bled in. I wouldn't want to see a Jeeves that mean and smarmy.

[trista-zevkia.livejournal.com]

"I've never felt Jeeves to be any sort of malicious to Wooster, even though a lot of his schemes do end up with Bertie looking a bit of a tit. I think that's just Jeeves having a bit of fun."

Rather! Bertie, without Jeeves, ends up looking lit a tit with a black eye. Bertie knows this, which is (part) of why he lets Jeeves do things his way. Jeeves uses Berties tit-worthiness(tm) in his schemes, but doesn't give Bertie more embarrassment than he can handle. Except when we make him do so, and we get make-up sex!

[sookail.livejournal.com]

*ggg* The slash fandom would`ve been significantly smaller...

[trista-zevkia.livejournal.com]

Drive by icon love!

[trista-zevkia.livejournal.com]

I think we might be selling Atkinson short, just a little. Sorry, but he's not always Mr. Bean or Blackadder. Do remember he writes a lot of this stuff himself. Did you see Thin Blue Line, where he was a cop? He was the smart, unlucky one who things never went right for. Or this gem about Shakespeare with a tall skinny dude who's name escapes me at the moment;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IwbB6B0cQs4

I think he could have done Jeeves, just not in the lovable, perfect for slashing way Mr. Fry did. But all the book covers I have with pictures of Jeeves, have him as old, white haired and frail. Despite him being described as having raven hair, a tall, strong body and eyes that would stir lust even in the most maidenly of bosoms. Plum wrote that, right? Of course, I'm a pervert, your backstory may vary;)

[stalkerbunny.livejournal.com]

I can't say I'm an expert on the books, since I've only read (or, in fact, listened to a reading) a few stories, but I did notice the difference. The episode with the terrifying bike ride is bad enough in the tv-series, but in the book there is a scene right before where Bertie, who is already afraid to do it, goes to Jeeves who tells him this... in that context perfectly horrifying "joke" about... a biking accident. And then he chuckles. ;o_o;

I honestly didn't know whether I should laugh or cry.

But to get to my point, while I really adore the language in the books and Bertie is a lovely character, I suspect that if I *hadn't* started with the Fry and Laurie version I probably would have disliked Jeeves. Which, as things are, would have been a pity.