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indeedsir_backupHallo there!
Fairly recent lurker and somewhat less recent Wodehouse fanatic, absolutely delighted to be here.
In the spirit of engendering debate in this fine community, I have a few questions to ponder over, viz and to whit:-
1) Which college was Bertie in at Oxford? I tend to peg him as either Christ Church or Magdalen; Magdalen because I'm completely biased (I want to study there), and because it was Oscar Wilde's college; Christ Church because it has an enormous quadrangle with a fountain, perfect for bicycling naked around and pretending to be a mermaid. ;)
2) Most people here, as do I, seem to slash Jeeves and Bertie (wahey!), but does anyone write slash involving other members of the Drones club? Personally, I like slashing Gussie Fink-Nottle, but I'm not entirely sure why.
3) Does anyone here read Raffles? I thought this would be the best place to look for fellow Raffles and Biggles fans, as we seem to be limited in number.
Well, off I go; charmed to be here. Expect some sort of fic from me, hopefully, within the near future. :)
Tinkerty-tonk,
Eli :D
Fairly recent lurker and somewhat less recent Wodehouse fanatic, absolutely delighted to be here.
In the spirit of engendering debate in this fine community, I have a few questions to ponder over, viz and to whit:-
1) Which college was Bertie in at Oxford? I tend to peg him as either Christ Church or Magdalen; Magdalen because I'm completely biased (I want to study there), and because it was Oscar Wilde's college; Christ Church because it has an enormous quadrangle with a fountain, perfect for bicycling naked around and pretending to be a mermaid. ;)
2) Most people here, as do I, seem to slash Jeeves and Bertie (wahey!), but does anyone write slash involving other members of the Drones club? Personally, I like slashing Gussie Fink-Nottle, but I'm not entirely sure why.
3) Does anyone here read Raffles? I thought this would be the best place to look for fellow Raffles and Biggles fans, as we seem to be limited in number.
Well, off I go; charmed to be here. Expect some sort of fic from me, hopefully, within the near future. :)
Tinkerty-tonk,
Eli :D
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Date: 2006-06-06 03:26 pm (UTC)2. Am I the only one to think Bertie/Jeeves does not compute? I mean, in relation to mental ages, it's positively chan. But I strongly believe in Jeeves/Roderick Spode and in Bertie/Stilton Cheesewright.
3. Yayyyy, Raffles & Biggles! And do you like Bulldog Drummond?
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Date: 2006-06-06 03:39 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 06:31 pm (UTC)I'd give you Bertie/Bingo, or even Bertie/Gussie or Bertie/Stinker, but of all Bertie's friends...Stilton? Really? Why?
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Date: 2006-06-06 09:17 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 10:40 pm (UTC)Got to say, though, the idea of Jeeves/Spode makes me reach for the brain bleach like nothing I've ever heard of or imagined. Frankly, Spode is #1 on my list of Wodehouse characters I don't want to think of in any kind of sexual situation ever. At all. Gah.
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Date: 2006-06-06 05:04 pm (UTC)...Y'know, I think it might say something about me, that I'm this excited about [hopefully, cross fingers, if my results are good enough etc] sharing an alma mater with Bertie Wooster. That something, of course, being that I'm a Wodehouse geek - hurrah!
Yaay Raffles and Biggles! Would you like some discussion? My email is yayoisama@gmail.com if you fancy some squeeing. :D
Eli :D
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Date: 2006-06-06 09:17 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 09:28 pm (UTC)when I'm not being a sneaky posting ninja and posting this when my parents think I'm asleepEli :D
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Date: 2006-06-06 04:41 pm (UTC)-K
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Date: 2006-06-06 04:49 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-07 11:18 am (UTC)your oxbridge education was a sign of your pedigree and breeding not brains
pretty much the same as for ivy-leagues back in the day after all
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Date: 2006-06-06 04:53 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 04:59 pm (UTC)Yeah I spend too much time thinking about this. ^^
What's the betting that Bertie's read Plato's Symposium?
Eli :D
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Date: 2006-06-06 05:02 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 05:12 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 05:00 pm (UTC)and gay. That's really all the Magdalen qualifications needed in those days. [Some might argue that 'gay' ior at least 'gay-friendly' is still a Magdalen qualification ]Eli :D
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Date: 2006-06-06 09:18 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 04:52 pm (UTC)2) I like slashing Tuppy :)
3) I love Raffles...Raffles/Bunny is so completely canon!
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Date: 2006-06-06 04:56 pm (UTC)Eli :D
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Date: 2006-06-06 04:57 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 05:13 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 09:19 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 09:27 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 04:52 pm (UTC)- er.
You should come and study at Magdalen. This university needs more Jooster fans.
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Date: 2006-06-06 04:55 pm (UTC)I want to read Classics, as it's the great love of my life. What's your passion?
Eli :D
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Date: 2006-06-06 04:59 pm (UTC)1. early 20th Century literature; Bloomsbury, the soldier-poets, the Auden Generation etc.
2. Medieval history and languages.
Thus I'm reading English, with a focus on medievalism, by and large (it's such a cheat; it's not even English. Whole papers on straight medieval history, the etymology of English, Old Norse literature, Old French language, etc), plus special papers on my modern fixations. I love my university. :D
What year are you in?
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Date: 2006-06-06 05:11 pm (UTC)Er, I'm actually right in the middle of sitting my GCSEs [English this morning, erg]. So...two or three years before I can attend. Although frankly, if I get accepted, I'll probably be all "SCREW THE GAP YEAR, OXFORD IS HITTING ON ME, BABY!"
Are you at Magdalen yourself?
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Date: 2006-06-06 09:30 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-07 11:19 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-07 11:20 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 05:50 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-06 06:25 pm (UTC)1) Yep, Magdalen. (Yet another reason for me to pine about not having gotten past interview...) And, as people pointed out, Bertie totally wouldn't have had any trouble getting in in that era, especially considering he went to Eton and all.
That being said: remember, we are, as readers, accepting his version of himself, and the boy's self esteem is a little wonky. His recall of quotes and whatnot is sporadic, but it is there and he tries to use it, and he's definitely studied Latin, based on the way he structures sentences. He's as helpless as a kitten in sticky situations, but so are absolutely all of his friends. (Okay, Bobbie Wickham. But she only gets halfway, most of the time.) Even Aunt Dahlia, who's certainly very bright.
2) There have been occasional murmurs of Bertie/Gussie, Bertie/Bingo, Bertie/Rocky, and *looks shifty* Jeeves/Psmith. *clears throat* Mostly in individual fics. You could probably get help digging those out if you batted imploring Bertie eyes at the community.
3) Ooh, yes! And, OMG. Raffles/Bunny: theirloveissocanonit'sreallyalmostembarrassingsometimes. (Especially because Raffles? Especially in early stories? Total sociopath. Like, textbook.) At the end of the first story, they have these lines (which I think I've quoted here before) where Raffles has his hands on Bunny's shoulders and Bunny's interior monologue is commenting on his handsomeness as he's saying, "Whatever you want me for, Raffles, I'm your man!" and I think the "Bwahaha!" I emitted the first time I read that could be heard three states away.
Also: Yay for more fic!
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Date: 2006-06-06 09:27 pm (UTC)Textbook sociopath? How? I never thought of Raffles that way, but you've piqued my curiosity. ^^
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Date: 2006-06-06 10:56 pm (UTC)The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, a widely used manual for diagnosing mental and behavioral disorders, defines antisocial personality disorder as a pervasive pattern of disregard for and violation of the rights of others occurring since age 15, as indicated by three (or more) of the following:
1. failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest
2. deceitfulness, as indicated by repeated lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure
3. impulsivity or failure to plan ahead
4. irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults
5. reckless disregard for safety of self or others
6. consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain steady work or honor financial obligations
7. lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another
Anything strike you there? I don't think that's what Hornung intended, mind you; I think he wanted this sort of dashing, sexy, scary-yet-vaguely pukkah antihero, and the Edwardian concepts of what was "manly" and "brave" are a bit weird to modern sensibilities. But look at that initial scene where Bunny's holding the gun to his own head and Raffles just watches, totally dispassionately, to see if he goes through with it. I love those stories and the dynamic between the characters, but...dude, Raffles is deeply alarming in his lack of caring sometimes.
Psychopathy is most commonly diagnosed using Robert D. Hare's Psychopathy Checklist-Revised (PCL-R). Hare describes psychopaths as, "intraspecies predators who use charm, manipulation, intimidation, and violence to control others and to satisfy their own selfish needs. Lacking in conscience and in feelings for others, they cold-bloodedly take what they want and do as they please, violating social norms and expectations without the slightest sense of guilt or regret."
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Date: 2006-06-07 03:28 pm (UTC)He is rather a bit of a charming screwball, isn't he? I suppose that's why he's so fascinating.
That, and Bunny's world-consuming crush on him.
*runs off to write slash and upload her Raffles icon, but for now, uses Titus icon again*
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Date: 2006-06-06 06:38 pm (UTC)1). NEver knew which one he went to.
2). Er other slash about the drones Yes There is some Psmith/Mike slash about I know Psmith is a drone. I'd love to see
3). Nope! But I'd love to read some Raffles.
Teuf-teuf!
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Date: 2006-06-06 09:25 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-07 05:39 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-06-07 12:38 am (UTC)2) I slashed Gussie with Bertie AND Jeeves, but I'm not sure who else he'd slash well with. Bingo, maybe? We never see any interaction between them, but presumably they also knew each other in school.
3) (A)I read Raffles years and years ago, when the TV show was on A&E. Actually liked the TV show better, because Raffles was nicer, but the stories are SO damned slashy. (B)I haven't actually ever found any Biggles. I should, shouldn't I? I get the impression it's sort of like George Manville Fenn only on steroids?
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Date: 2006-06-07 03:25 pm (UTC)Mmm. Gussie himself just hits my slash buttons. Gussie/Bingo would be cute, although I would contemplate the idea of Gussie/Boko if I didn't like Nobby/Boko so much. ^^
Yes, Raffles is pure distilled slash on legs. And OMG Biggles, and OMG Manville Fenn XD I don't think anything can top (dirty chuckle) G.M. Fenn for sheer slash.
They have pilots. Gay pilots. Awesome.
Eli :D